The UK’s Online Safety Act regulation comes into force in March. Although this forum has never to our knowledge breached the terms of the act, it is impossible in its current state to make it fully compliant. And given that traffic here is minimal to non-existent – and that the forum isn’t fully functioning and needs substantial updates we are not in a position to provide – our current plan is to close the forum before the act comes into force, which is March 2025.

Facebook is perhaps the most lively place for Wire discussion right now, either on Wire’s own page or in the Blessed state group.

In the meantime, should you have contacts here you’ve been communicating with via whispers or want to save any threads/notes/info, now would be the time to do so.

Not signed in (Sign In)

Vanilla 1.1.4 is a product of Lussumo. More Information: Documentation, Community Support.

Welcome Guest!
Want to take part in these discussions? If you have an account, sign in now.
If you don't have an account, apply for one now.
  1.  
    Oh, by the way, I had halved the price on the lyrics and one of them then went straight away. Is anyone interested in any of the other collectables? For example the £1000 Reward:

    A white label test pressing of the entire Nine Sevens set of singles - Wire's early singles work remastered in 2018. Plus: Thanks on the credits. Invitation to a special preview screening. A limited edition print of a scene from the film. A limited edition BluRay with unreleased footage. A digital download of the film

    If the person interested in this reward lives too far from London to make the preview screening, they can have a film logo limited edition print as referred to above instead.
  2.  
    ItContinues says: "I'd conclude that perhaps Wire are not the definitive post-punk band outside of this discussion board"
    With respect, this board is pretty quiet and has been for some time - and as with most forums like this the discussion has naturally dissolved onto social media - there is an Idealcopyists Facebook page which I think Malcolm is on anyway. This initial campaign I feel has been focussed on the hardcore so far - and the amount raised reflects how deep our pockets are. I've done my bit, but quite a few Copyists have said they simply can't afford it - so we'll see how the total stands at the end of the pledge campaign. I would suggest that if the big ticket pledges don't sell they should go onto Discogs - there will be people on there who will snap up Wire rarities but will never come near a forum like this or be signed up to Wire 'socials'.
  3.  
    Not sure i'd agree with the statement that the success of this crowdfunding campaign reflects the perception of the world on whether Wire is the definitive post-punk band, nor would i necessarily take it as a sign of very low popularity of the band.
    Although we all know that Wire is a relatively niche band, there surely are way more than 250 people in the world interested in Wire, considering that wherever i have seen them playing live there have always been between 250 and 600-700 people depending on town and venue, for EACH gig.
    if they do a tour with 20 towns they will have had at the end of the tour easily more than 5,000 people attending the gigs. And from what i can tell after having seen them playing in several countries (among them UK, Italy, Germany, Holland, Belgium, Spain, Portugal etc.) the audience has always had positive reactions to the shows.
    To be honest i think i know myself personally more than 250 people interested into Wire.
    I mean, the 2017 Indiegogo crowdfunding campaign for a film on Poly Styrene has had more than 1,800 supporters and collected 80,000 pounds. I cannot really imagine that X Ray Spex really is nearly 10 times as popular as Wire.
    Even the recent Nash the Slash film crowdfunding campaign has had 600 backers (although in terms of money it raised "only" 35,000 pounds).
    I still think the relatively low number of backers also depends on the way the campaign has been structured. It seems to target mainly the hardcore fan, but possibly slightly overestimating the actual financial possibilities of many of them. While for the more occasional fan the rewards are possibly not interesting enough for the money they cost.
    I might be wrong of course...
  4.  
    The Poly Styrene film will be a more personal, human story about race, gender and mental health - the strapline is "Some people think little girls should be seen and not heard" - so right there that's a powerful message and the film will have universal appeal way beyond people who are fans of XRay Spex. Also they had mugs and Tote bags - silly stuff like that really helps hook people in on crowdfunding.

    We've all read the Wire books and it's not exactly 'Hammer of the Gods', it's not a rock and roll story and they've tended to keep their lives private and separate from the music so there's no great emotional heft to this story either. There is an interesting story in Wire, the band are engaging and enigmatic people so it'll make a great doc - the trailer is brilliant - but this might not have much reach beyond people who into the music. BBC4 regularly screen Music docs, but alas they turned down the chance to show the XTC documentary - even though they clocked up several chart hits in the UK - so one about Wire might be a hard sell even for that channel.

    Anyway we are where we are - 8 days to go - PLEDGE!
  5.  
    "Also they had mugs and Tote bags - silly stuff like that really helps hook people in on crowdfunding."

    If there were more lower priced rewards it's possible that the film would be a good deal nearer to it's target.
  6.  
    "If there were more lower priced rewards it's possible that the film would be a good deal nearer to it's target."

    That's my gut sense, too. When I've contributed to various crowd-sourced projects, the basic, low-price reward is the album/dvd, which is normally around what it would cost to buy it in the shops, with steady increments involving posters, shirts, and mention in the credits, then the higher end being a combination of the previous stuff plus rarities or a meet n greet. The lowest rewards here cost more than it would to wait for it to be released. The disconnect, I suspect, is that the producer believes pledgers are doing so as a statement of faith in the value of the project. And I imagine people here who have pledged already fall in that camp. But to the non-hardcore fan, those interested in seeing the final results but not fully invested (ho ho) in it being made, their position is to just pay for it up front, full stop. That's their contribution, a pre-pay for the movie. They'd question whether they're getting value for the money by paying two or three times what they would once it's released (and if it isn't released, oh well). So, a lower entry-level reward may not generate as much cash per person devoted to the project, but it has a greater likelihood of reaching the target total by drawing in more "casual" fans.
  7.  
    I take the points above and am looking at lower price options. I do think that putting people's names on credits for less than £500 is a bit off. Not trying to put any of those on lower incomes off, but names-on-credits carry a lot of kudos in the film world and usually take professional qualifications and experience to attain. Or a big cash investment.

    Part of the reason for so many incentives for Frank Sidebottom and Nash The Slash is that they don't have the cultural clout of Wire so folk need incentivising to support them more. Also, given the number of Nash The Slash contributors, they didn't make much money per contributor and not nearly as much as us. It's all very well having a lot of pledgers but the goal is to make money and get the film made.
  8.  
    Reading over this thread I'm afraid I have to agree with the overall sentiment that this campaign seems to be designed a bit backwards, which has found me dragging my feet as far as contributing goes.

    Any of the campaigns I have looked at or participated in placed emphasis on the smaller rewards. There really aren't any here. You have to hit £100 before arriving at anything that may or may not be unique to the campaign - the bonus outtakes.

    What happened to the posters? It looks like only one showed up, and only included with the £15.4k package unless I missed something. Oh well.

    Why not run off a stack of 100 nice inkjet A3-ish prints of the poster? Limited edition, numbered, low cost, done. You could even call them "giclee" prints and make people feel all fancy-like about it. I personally wouldn't even care if it was signed. It would in fact be even more amusing if it were just rubber-stamped with "Wire" or "Dugga" at the bottom. That and a disc of the film would get my £50 immediately; I'd frame the print up to put with my old Ideal Copy, Bell, and IBTABA posters and be quite happy.

    It is also unfortunate that a thank you list after the film's credits is not being discussed. Credits are reserved for high rollers, I get it, but plenty of films offer a disc and your name in the thank-you list for well below £100.

    The goal here seems to be attracting a few people who have a lot of money to spend, rather than actually following the spirit of 'crowdsourcing' and getting smaller amounts from many. I suppose I'll pony up for the £100 package because only at that point do things start getting interesting, but yes, it will annoy me down the line if I find that the retail package has all the same content.

    Anyone remember the Change Becomes Us packages? When the closets were emptied of old rare releases like It's All In The Brochure and 12 Times U and attached to select CBU/R&B book orders for what IIRC was under or around £100? Anyone else find a few Pink Flag pins tossed in when their order showed up?

    Those were the days.
  9.  
    The credits thing is a bit odd for a crowdfunded feature. I’ve been party to a lot of CF stuff, and many of them start the credits inclusion at a pretty low tier. It isn’t about prestige – it’s about getting bums on seats (cash from wallets). There would be nothing to stop a film of this sort having tiers within the credits – “special thanks to” for the higher-tier backers, and then everyone else in smaller text and a big wodge of scrolling text.
  10.  
    I *THINK* the credits stuff in a lot of Kickstarter (for example) projects is just that; a "thank you" to crowdfunders... this sounds like it's meant to be more of a contributor thing (though I could be wrong).

    I chucked in what I could - but I do agree, if there was something good at £10 or £15 - I'd up my pledge to include it. "Add £10 to any pledge for a recording from a Drill fest" - or the official bootlegs or whatever.

    That being said, I've never run a crowdsourced campaign - friends I know who have say the more backers they deal with, the more headaches they have... ("My item arrived late." "So and so got their item, where's mine?" etc). There is something to be said for chasing the deeper pockets (and more 'serious' folks) - reducing headaches.

    I mean - there are a lot of folks here noting things seem odd... but I bet most (all?) of us have contributed... so SOMETHING worked LOL
  11.  
    I think the problem with this project is that a target of £60,000 is way too high. Is it really that expensive to do it?
    And the rewards make no sense at all to me, sorry. £30 for a simple digital download is abusive. £50 for a blu-ray..... The other rewards are not that interesting in my opinion, either, I wouldn't pay that high for a Wire test pressing or a print or a private screening. I consider what most of us Wire fans want to see is THE MOVIE released, above all, just that. I'd like to contribute and make it possible, but the donations are too high. It's sad to see that only 244 supporters have contributed, for a movie of a legendary band as Wire is, but it's also understandable and I think a lot of us just don't want to pay that money for it. The project (sorry again) looks a bit too ambitious and kind of elitist.
    If the movie is finished and released... will only a few hundred copies be made for the few fans who donated for it? Then if the rest are sold afterwards, what will be the price? The same as for the ones who donated? That wouldn't be too fair. If not, then, even more expensive? That would be crazy.
    Good luck, in any case, with the project, and I really hope that it succeeds. And please don't take my words as offensive or anything, it's only my sincere opinion about the project and the problems it's having to succeed.
  12.  
    Fabio, 60k is just the start - the pitch says they then need to get more cash from 'funding bodies and other sources' to cover the cost of licensing the music, footage and images. This is the reason a lot of docs like this don't get made.

    I am absolutely baffled by Malcolm's comment that "names-on-credits carry a lot of kudos in the film world and usually take professional qualifications and experience to attain. Or a big cash investment". I think I'll just have to agree to disgaree with the filmmakers here. As others have said, names on credits are a cheap and easy way to attract some crowd funding, pretty standard on Book and music projects - nobody wants to take away the glory from the 'gaffer', the 'key grip', the 'runners' and the people who bankroll films with huge investments, nor expect to buy their way into the "film world" for 50 quid - it's just a bit of text scrolling past to say Thank You. It's a tried and tested Crowdfunding hook to get lots of small donations in.

    I agree with the 'eltist' comment - we can all see how many of those big ticket items have been sold but the film-makers have made it clear they don't want small contributions from lots of Wire fans, they want big cash donations from wealthy Wire fans. The number of pledges doesn't reflect the Wire fanbase, it reflects the exclusive approach the film-makers have taken.
  13.  
    R Swimmer et al, please let me be clear. ALL donations are hugely appreciated and all help to build the crowd and the budget. If a thousand people gave £20 we'd obviously be in a great position. What I don't get is the demand for a Reward that's close to the value of the donation. That is just not the point. The point is to support the film.

    I have consulted with other hardcore longtime devoted Wire fans about this, and they agree with me the value of the Reward Packages is in line with other such projects they've seen. Just give £20! Or give £30! And get a download worth £8.99!! Probably ahead of official release if it can be arranged.

    Re: Craig's point; I did actually take on board comments about the price of names on credits. I wrote to those who had taken the entry level £500 rewards to ask if they minded if I adjusted the entry level downwards. However I only heard back from two so was legally bound to keep it as it was. Apologies.

    The idea of valuing credits at around £500 isn't from me, it's advice given by independent bodies to those financing films by crowdfunding. I appreciate smaller acts like Frank Sidebottom and Nash The Slash can only do it by this method, so of necessity all names tend to appear on the credits in those circumstances. I have faith that Wire's achievements and significance could lead to funding by bodies like the BFI and Sundance, which means we won't have to ask for much money from fans who can't afford it. Just those who can!

    Fabio, it's impossible to make an average feature documentary for much below £250, 000. For context the Amy Winehouse doc was £1,500,000 budget. My mate cut it full time for a year and he is not rich! Films are expensive to make.
  14.  
    UPDATE:

    The Crowdfunding campaign just hit £54,962!!

    That's 92% of our Crowdfunding target!

    We have just THREE DAYS left to hit £60, 000.

    Any contribution at all helps. It's as much about building a crowd and showing potential distributors and buyers support for the idea of the film.

    If you haven't already; get involved!

    crowdfunder.co.uk/wirefilm
  15.  
    “What I don't get is the demand for a Reward that's close to the value of the donation. That is just not the point. The point is to support the film.”

    Sure, but that is also the nature of a lot of modern crowdfunding, which is often about testing the water combined with a pre-order of sorts. So see if there’s a market, while simultaneously funding the thing. I have backed a slew of albums, books, and the odd film in this manner. Most – although not all – have a premium over the content you’d be able to generally buy elsewhere, but mostly in the sense of heading very much to a ‘full price’ way of thinking versus the cut-price media we typically see everywhere today.

    Getting past that mentality is tricky – hence why a great number of campaigns add little ‘nice to haves’ that don’t impact negatively on the item itself, and yet encourage more support.

    "The idea of valuing credits at around £500 isn't from me, it's advice given by independent bodies to those financing films by crowdfunding.”

    Fair enough. Perhaps the Wire film is aiming at a different tier. But this flies in the face of campaigns I’ve supported and had minor involvement in that have targeted similar amounts of cash. So I have a number of premium books that set aside a bunch of pages for backers, and the odd film where the credits includes a big block of supporters. Frankly, I skip over them, but some people love to see their name printed there – and it can get more people parting with cash. The issue for you is that given how many other crowdfunders do that almost by default, the Wire one risks coming across as elitist in this regard (which I know it isn’t).
  16.  
    Craig, see my edited comments above. I did try and revise credits price downwards but wasn't able to.
  17.  
    Please be reassured the BluRay "with unique outtakes" will be just that. Different from the regular edition.
  18.  
    STOP PRESS!

    The names of ALL Crowdfunders for the Wire film will be immortalised in the BluRay and DVD release inserts.

    Please spread the word about this!!
  19.  
    I can also put a link to a microsite on the film credits. wirefilmcrowdfunders.com or something; where all funders can be listed.

    You'll recall Chris Morris did something similar with Jam at jamcredits.com - saves the "skip over them" aspect, which most people do, or leave the cinema.
  20.  
    LAST FEW DAYS!!

    I have dropped the price on the Wire 154 EP collectables from £1500 to £1000 for the last three days of the campaign

    And to remind you once more ANYONE who pledges will get their name in the DVD and BluRay booklets.